The resources section has ideas/links for left behind packages

August 22, 2017

Lisa Gwinn

What happens when a high priestess of Satan tries to seduce a man and encounters a power that causes all Hell to break loose?

Next, on this edition of It's Supernatural.

Life after death experiences and angelic visitations are on the increase. Terminally ill patients whom doctors have given no hope are unexplainably cured. People are being mysteriously protected from natural disasters. Sid Roth, investigative reporter, examines this invisible world on It's Supernatural.

Sid: Hello. I'm Sid Roth, your investigative reporter. My guest was a high priestess of Satan. Most people think that this is just cartoons, a figment of someone's imagination. I mean, the devil is someone with a red suit and tail and horns and Flip Wilson's 'the devil made me do it.' But it's real.

Lisa Gwinn, how did you originally get into Satanism.

Lisa: My motivation was...I was raised in a very abusive home, environment. A victim at a very young age. And that victimization will often make you look for power, for control. For ways to not become a victim any more. You know, I remember at a very young age, going, 'I will never be hurt like this again.' And trying to find ways to assure that.

And the enemy is very capable. Satanic worship, witchcraft, ESP - all have a draw of power on them. That was very, very appealing to me.

Sid: You had an abusive stepfather that you wanted to get the edge on, so to speak.

Lisa: Right.

Sid: But how does a young child...I mean how DOES a young child get into Satanism?

Lisa: There are a lot of different factors. For me, I can tell you that media played a big role. I remember growing up, one of my favorite songs was about a woman who had the title of a witch in the song. And she could hold men spell-bound by the look in her eyes. You know. To sing along with those words and dream about having that much power over our abusers.

I had a friend who also in an abusive situation. We kind of bonded together, just to get each other through. You know? Two of our favorite shows were about a witch and a genie. Television shows. Young and impressionable kids in situations of being hurt and abused all the you know what a draw it was to watch these shows and to wish that all we had to do was twitch our nose or blink our eyes.

Sid: Did you believe that when you were watching it?

Lisa: You will believe anything. When you are in a situation where you are being violated, driven down, torn apart and shredded emotionally - you'll grasp to any hope. In any port in a storm. And in desperation, you'll begin to believe whatever you can.

With us, we went to our...just our school libraries. Lots of books on ESP, increasing your ESP abilities. Lots of books on witchcraft. You know? Our libraries are full of books on the occult.

Sid: But you had an uncle that helped you on.

Lisa: Yes. I had an uncle related by marriage who was the only adult, for a long time, that listened to me. That seemed to respect me. We'd sit and have long talks, because as I began studying about the supernatural and the occult and ESP and things of that sort, he would encourage me in those studies. And I had no idea he was a Satanic priest. And so, he was pretty much grooming me to be incorporated into that lifestyle.

Sid: other words, you didn't know that he was a Satanic priest? Would it have bothered you if you knew it?

Lisa: Probably not. I probably would have found it very appealing. More than likely.

Sid: So. Did you reach a point where this power stopped your stepfather from abusing you?

Lisa: Yes. I remember him coming toward me once. And I stood there and I visualized... By the time this happened, I had these little imaginary friends. People that I could only see. You know, kids have imaginary friends. But MY imaginary friends, I believed, were so powerful. Actually, what it was is, spiritual forces that I had put myself through agreement, a contract with. It put an aura and a power around me that, when he came toward me, you know, it was like, no way. And he backed away, looking like this...

Sid: How old were you at that time?

Lisa: I was thirteen. Took all that time, I was already a Satanist at that time. I was initiated at age twelve.

Sid: Now, most of what I know about that is what you see on television. But that's not even the tip of the iceberg. How bad is Satanism?

Lisa: It's very prevalent. You have to understand, Satanism is not just the worshipping of Satan. Satanism is any religion or practice that fosters man's belief in himself. And his separation and independence from a higher power. From we understand Him to be.

Sid: But I read about sacrificing children. Is this for real?

Lisa: That's for real. If you let your imagination run wild with you, a lot of what you believe and picture about Satanism is real. The problem comes with media. Media has been desensitizing people for years and years.

Sid: Do you think it's intentional?

Lisa: I think part of it is, yeah. I believe that we have spiritual forces that are working daily to keep the general public doubtful of their existence. of the things you'll do in warfare is, you'll try to make your enemy think you don't exist. You know, that way you can run rip shod over and he'll never take up arms against you.

Sid: Great defense.

Lisa: So, Christians for a long time, in media, have been played as, you know. You always see Christians in the movies standing up to the dragon and spiritual people having spiritual powers of good.. and they always end up getting chewed up and spit out. You have the witch, you know, trying to do 'good' things with bad magic. And they're coming out on top.

Or you'll see all of this gore displayed, as far as the occult. And it's so portrayed in such an extravagant manner, people believe that's all it is. Extravagance. Rather than all of that based on reality.

Sid: Why do they sacrifice a child? In Satanism.

Lisa: Satanism is predominantly based in old law. What you would call Old Testament law. Eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth. It goes back to the original sin of man, which caused an animal to have to die for God to make skins to clothe man, because he fell.

Sin has always led to the shedding of blood, and therefore the blood has always been a way of paying for sin. Okay? But also, there's life in the blood. And every pagan religion in the world, there's some kind of sacrifice. Some kind, whether it's animal, grain, person. It's like, what you give up to your god, it's all based in works. There's no grace.

Sid: Lisa. How did you feel when you saw a life being taken?

Lisa: The first time? Terrified. I blocked it out for years. I didn't recall it for a long time. Eventually, you get hardened to it. You realize that what you are doing have a need to achieve a certain power or a certain goal. And if one person suffers because of that, that's the cost. And you come to grips with the cost.

Sid: Why did you have a need to have a certain power, a certain goal? Why did you have a need?

Lisa: By that time, my whole identity came from what people told me I was and who people told me I was. My abilities. Once you get involved in the kingdom of darkness, it's a dog-eat-dog mentality, blood-slinger mentality. And so you progress from power to power, and there's always somebody trying to knock you out. Your whole identity is consumed with what you can achieve and how much power you can get for yourself and control.

Sid: What did you think would happen when you died?

Lisa: I believed that I would go to be with my master in the kingdom of darkness and be given a position of rulership there.

Sid: But certainly you heard about Jesus?

Lisa: Jesus, to me, was a man who was stupid enough to find himself nailed to a cross. He was a good man, okay. He had a message from God. But unless people took advantage of his message, they had no authority to stop you. If they chose not to learn how to stop me - then they didn't have a right to keep anything I wanted to take from them.

Sid: Okay. A time came when they wanted you to have a child so that they could sacrifice it, or use it in some way. Why in the world did you find this distasteful?

Lisa: It's different when it's yours. You know? That's an ultimate thing. But at the time they asked me for that, I had had two major experiences in my life, that had started me on an adventure of questioning everything that I had been taught for 20 years.

All of the spiritual laws and principles that I had been taught, that gave me the right or rights to use and manipulate and control the powers of darkness, I was beginning to question. Because I had encounters that were not supposed to have been able to happen.

Sid: Like what?

Lisa: The first was, I was moved to another state. That's often done, put people in position in different states, because they view it territorially to maintain control in certain areas. I was moved to this one state and one of my assignments was to tear apart or destroy the ministry of this one man who had started teaching on spiritual warfare.

Sid: Why would you care about...If Jesus didn't exist, what difference did it make to tear a minister apart or not? What's the big deal?

Lisa: Because this minister believed in everything that Jesus did. And he was standing on spiritual laws that were superior to ours. For example. You know, a person could die a pauper if they never knew they had a million dollars in the bank. Most Christians believe they have a million dollars in the bank - they just never go withdraw it.

Sid: Okay. So this man was making trouble for your kingdom. What was the objective. What did you want to do with this man? This minister?

Lisa: We wanted to get him out of ministry, however we had to do that. And if we couldn't do that, we would destroy him - kill him.

Sid: Had you, or your friends, done this with other ministers previously?

Lisa: Yes. I'll tell you, at the specific time that I was sent to this one city, they had five other people positioned. One was in a major city where a major ministry fell as a result of that.

Sid: How do you cause a minister to fall?

Lisa: You look for weaknesses, for vices that you can manipulate. Any sin, loophole, area of impropriety. You find his greatest source of counsel and unity. You know, if he has a partner. For a church, for example. You would look at the pastor and associate pastor. The pastor and music leader. You know. Find the strongest source of unity and divide it. Divide and conquer.

Sid: Okay. What happened when you went to this particular church?

Lisa: I went in...I kept sending people in, first. You know. To go in, what we called infiltrators. And they weren't coming back. Some of them were just not getting anywhere and were too embarrassed to come back and admit failure. Because that's...a no no. I mean, you don't admit failure, that's a weakness.

Sid: So. You now, at the level you're at, are going to go in and take care of business. Right?

Lisa: Right. 'Cause I had people above me that were sitting on me, going why aren't you getting this done? Okay. So, here I go in to handle it myself.

(Sid - commercial break period.)

Sid: Hello. I'm Sid Roth, your investigative reporter. I imagine you didn't even run to the refrigerator to get food! During the break, because my guest was a high priestess of Satan. Her job was to go into churches and cause the pastors or the leadership to fall. And just the power in this one particular church was hurting her kingdom, and she had sent other people there to disrupt their church. And it hadn't been successful.

Lisa Gwinn, you decided YOU'RE going to take care of it. What happened?

Lisa: Well, I went in under the guise of wanting help from the pastor, who was doing so much counseling and helping people with occult pasts. And my encounter with him was...really shook the foundation of everything that I had been taught. I was taught that I served the ultimate power. Well, five minutes after I walked through the door, he began to pray to HIS God. And what that did to me was really wreak havoc. And it caused all of the demonic powers that I thought I had controlled to pretty much come out, manifest themselves. You know, the room began to fill up when he prayed. And really, they began to threaten me, because I had taken them into a situation against a power that they couldn't stand against.

After that point, I began to question everything I'd been taught about Satanism. About the powers of darkness. Because I had been taught that I served this supreme ruler in darkness, the supreme power. And then, all of a sudden...

Sid: Listen, if they're afraid of this Christian minister, while you're alive. How about the repercussions of what happens when you die? You thought you were assuring yourself a kingdom with Satan. But he can't even handle things in THIS life.

Lisa: That's true, that's true. Satan's pretty much a spoiled brat who knows his time is near, and he's pulling out all the stops to keep his sand castle kingdom from being washed away.

Sid: So, did this minister tell you to accept Jesus? Did you?

Lisa: He did, but I didn't. Everything that I knew about Jesus was no power. All the churches I had ever been in, and a lot of the Christians I had known...just were wimps. You know, they said God was all powerful, but they were always going through all these circumstances. They had no power in their life.

Sid: Yeah, but this particular one was obviously powerful. So, why didn't you accept Jesus?

Lisa: There's another factor involved in that.

Sid: What's that?

Lisa: After a while, you're so used to the kingdom of darkness, you believe you ARE of the kingdom of darkness and you can't change. It's like holding out, you know...

Sid: It's like a homosexual that thinks they can't change.

Lisa: Yeah - thinks he's chained. That there's no other option. There quickly became an apparent other option. The Lord began to just put miraculous circumstances in my life. God would orchestrate people that came into my life.

Sid: There was a person that came into your life. You were instructed to have a child, for the sake of sacrifice and you rebelled. You didn't want to do that. And so you ran.

Lisa: Yeah.

Sid: Weren't you afraid?

Lisa: Yeah, I was. But I knew when I made the choices that I made. I knew that if I ever decided to leave that they would come and kill me. And I accepted the consequences of that.

Sid: And they sent an infiltrator. Tell me about him.

Lisa: Well, I kinda fell in love with this guy, he was the 'cat's meow' you know. He was everything I ever wanted. And after 6 months of living together I discovered that he, too, was a high priest that had been sent just to keep tabs on my life. I confronted him with that knowledge, managed to separated myself from him and shortly thereafter found out that I was pregnant. He made it real clear, being a high priest, he said, 'That's my ticket. That child's my ticket.'

Faced with that option, abortion became my option. Which he didn't take lying down, you don't do that. You don't abort the child of a high priest. And so he pretty much broke into my apartment the next day with some of his friends, destroyed just about everything in it and beat me so badly I was told I could never have children. At that point, I ran. I ran out to the west coast, and buried myself working for the motion picture studios, just trying to hide.

Sid: But you had a grandmother that didn't give up on you, that knew how to get in touch with God. And one day she called you.

Lisa: Yeah. She would call me all the time, through the years. I'm in the midst of sin, and here the answering machine would come on. I'd hear her say, "De Lor' have mercy, Chile. I don't know what you been doin', but I been talking to God and He tole me to call you, and tell you to stop!" I couldn't believe her timing!

Sid: When she said those things, what did you think?

Lisa: I used to think, 'Man, Gramma's just got it altogether, she knows about spiritual power.' I never thought about the source of that spiritual power. You know? But when she called and told me, she said, "I don't need to know everything you've been involved in, don't want to. You need to find a man who believes in the power of God, a preacher or somebody. Tell them what you've been involved in and ask for help."

And I did - and got no results.

Sid: Why?

Lisa: Well, the first church I went to, the pastor got kinda scared and said, "We don't want any trouble here." and showed me to the door. Because a lot of churches, while they affirm the power of God, they deny there is a devil. They take half of the Bible and believe it and throw out the other half.

The other pastor, didn't believe a word I said. Still another one told me, "What you have to do is, you have to pray every day, go to church every week, and read your Bible every day." And he gave me all these step by step things to do. And I look at him and said, "That sounds like ritual to me. And if I'm not mistaken, it's ritual that got me in this condition."

So I gave up.

Sid: But, fortunately you saw someone on television.

Lisa: I did. I started watching this minister on television, and he had a rather miraculous, powerful television show. And I found out, he was going to be in the area, and I decided that I would go and check him out. To see if what I was seeing on TV was true.

Sid: And?

Lisa: The last meeting, I started to leave. And through just a series of events and people, I chose to stay. And he opened the sermon that night with saying, 'I don't know if you've ever had the devil visit you in your home.' And he began to share an encounter that he had had, with a demonic presence. And he had my attention.

I listened to what he said, he began to pray afterward, called out miracles and healing and things. And he said, 'If you've felt the power of God, come down here.' Well, I didn't feel anything, but the person next to her pushed me out into the aisle. And I was kind of caught in the flow, because obviously hundreds of other people had felt something and they were all crammed in the aisle. I had no choice.

So, I ended up getting up onto the stage and he prayed for me. And nothing happened. Absolutely nothing happened. And I walked off the stage and here this teenager that had pushed me out into the aisle to begin with, came and said, "Get back in line! You came here for something, don't leave without it."

And I told him, "I know where the line is. I crossed it. The point of no return. And I can live with that." But on my way out the door, here came this teenage boy again, with his pastor, towing him toward me saying, "Help me pray for this girl.'

That pastor confronted me with a question. He said, "What do you want? If God or Jesus were standing here and asked you what you wanted, what would you tell Him?"

I began my list. I wanted to know what peace of mind was. What it was like to say the word beautiful again. What it was like to go to sleep more than two or three hours a night without things moving in the room, or voices. I wanted to know what peace was. And as I gave him the list, I noticed my face was wet. And I reached up and wiped these tears away.

And I guess the shock really showed, 'cause this preacher said, "What?" And I all I could stutter was, "I didn't think they worked anymore." I realized I was crying.

Sid: Why?

Lisa: I had said years before, the last time I had cried, I said I would never shed another tear. When I was eight years old. 'Cause I was falsely accused of something. And it so wounded me, and the person that accused me said, "See? She's guilty because she's crying. If she wasn't guilty, she wouldn't be crying." And I viewed tears as being something so horrible.

But through those tears, he asked me. He said, "If God could give you these things, would you give Him a chance?" And I said certainly. I made a deal with the devil once. I could certainly do the same for God and give Him a try.

He led me in a prayer, acknowledging I was a sinner and asking the Lord to forgive me. And that began the change in my life. Everything from the next couple of days...

Sid: What happened that night when you went home?

Lisa: Oh, I started driving from San Hosea to Los Angeles and the more I drove, the drunker I got. I mean, I was getting queasy. I hadn't had anything to drink - alcohol. But I felt drunk. I remember stopping for gas and I was washing my hands in the bathroom, and I started laughing. Just laughing. And I was so drunk, and laughing so hard, I ended up throwing my wallet to the cashier...

Sid: But you didn't have... You didn't drink any alcohol?

Lisa: No! No. All I can say is, God was doing spiritual surgery on me, and the laughter was an anesthetic. He was using know, the Bible says that laughter works like a medicine. He was using that laughter to do a lot of healing, inside of me. Because I had gotten into Satanism from woundedness. You know? And you can't just quit something, when you don't get rid of the cause. You know. You can't treat the symptom, but if you don't get to the wound, you're just gonna substitute another symptom. You know?

So the Lord used that, and He began to do surgery on me. And for a couple of days, I was just drunk. When I made it home, I went to sleep 11:30 in the morning. Hadn't slept for two days. I went to sleep at 11:30 in the morning, I'd never slept more than an hour or two in a night. I woke up 9:30 the NEXT morning. Twenty-two hours later in the same position I went to sleep in.

Sid: How'd you feel?

Lisa: Still drunk! And it's been nothing but a change ever since. A great adventure of watching the Lord take me from step of freedom to step of freedom.

Sid: Yeah, but you don't leave as a high priestess of Satan and say, "Bye bye, guys. I'm now a believer in Jesus."

I understand the daughter of one of the top priests - or THE top priest in the world of Satanism came after you. Tell me about it.

Lisa: Yeah, they sent enforcers - people that will either kill you or take you back - to kill me. Three enforcers and myself out in the desert. And I told them, "In the name of Jesus, you have to let me go." They did. I should have told them, "In the name of Jesus, you can't touch me!" 'cause I was pretty much a lot worse for wear when they did let me go. But the Lord delivered me out of that situation.

Later I asked the Lord, did they do that? Because I knew these men who didn't kill me were going to be killed for not fulfilling their assignment. And the Lord took me into the book of Romans, where it says that if we've been buried with Christ in baptism, if we've entered into the family of God, then we've been buried with Him in death. And the old me, the only one they had license to kill, was the old me. The one who did all of those things. And when I accepted the Lord, I became a new creation. And as long as I keep the old me dead, He will keep the new me alive. That's how I walked away.

Sid: The devil has got power. You know that. Are you telling me that he's got nothing compared to the power of God?

Lisa: He has nothing. He has counterfeits, wrapped up in pretty packages, that he's been using since the beginning of time to fool people into thinking that he's the ultimate power. So that folks will never know, that there is not only ultimate power in God, but part of that power is the strength of Love God has for people.

Sid: If you do not know God, you don't know love. If you do not know acceptance, you have no way of coping with what's going on in this world. To know God, is to know Love. To know God is to know the Jewish Messiah, Jesus. When you repent of your sin and you turn from them. And you say, "I believe Jesus died for my sins." You are washed clean and God will live inside of you, and God will give you a peace. Like what you're experiencing now. Some of you are experiencing the peace of God right now. As soon as we're through, you do business with the Living God.